why isn't there much chat on here yet?

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why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by Sandy » Thu Nov 03, 2011 2:09 pm

Is everyone shy? i hope it gets busier so we can help each other

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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by TKH » Sat Nov 19, 2011 10:59 am

My family and I have been through a long court poceedings 18months + originally they forced me to make my son move out after an accident and then went for a Care Order the GAL supported the kids staying at home so an interim SO was granted. After a hell of a year the CS applied for a SO insted at the final hearing. There were so many inaccuracies and downright lies in papers for court (as there had been in previous proceedings-that were dredged up for this) I was assured it would all get cleared up and I would be able to dispute all at final hearing - originally set for seven days. In the end it was two half days with a day between for Judge to deliberate. In one of the half days Judge spent quite some time with my two eldest girls.The end result was no SO we were pleased but I am now feeling so angry! We had no support whilst proceedings were ongoing everyone (bar GAL) was on a mission to find things that supported the decision they had already come to -to remove the kids permanently.Two of my children were due to receive help from CAMHs but they wouldnt work with them once child protection started. I could go on and on about the different ways they slowed down any progress we were making as a family and banged on about things that just weren't true!
I want to move on but am so bitter and feel so scared that it will all start from nowhere again.The kids are still on the CPP which is fine but they are likely ro be removed in Dec.How do I put all this behind us?

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Suzie, FRG Adviser
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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by Suzie, FRG Adviser » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:12 pm

Dear TKH,
Welcome to Family Rights Group parents discussion board. I am sorry to hear that you have had a very difficult, stressful and at times traumatic time with the threat of your children being removed from you permanently. If I can re cap-:You are now at the tail end of CS involvement-with the likelihood that your children’s names will come off a child protection plan. You are worried that CS will become involved again and use evidence –much of which you dispute- and that you will be back in court. You are also looking for support to help you move on from the court proceedings.

The Court proceedings
There will be a court bundle (which will contain all the statements and reports filed) Have you got a copy from your solicitor?. A copy of this will be kept on the children’s file. Although the statements were never fully tested at a final hearing, your views are present-in your statement in the court bundle. The judge may have given his judgment in writing. He appears to have effectively come down fully on your side-going beyond the more cautious Guardian who wanted a supervision order and throwing out the care plan of the social worker. This means alot says alot about the evidence of the SW.

The Guardians report is usually the last report filed-commenting on everyone else’s statements and making a recommendation to the court. The court by law also place a lot of value on the recommendations in the guardians report. Do you agree with the guardians report?
If CS were to become involved again-then it will be the guardian’s report and any court judgment that are likely to be looked at first.
There is often also an agreed chronology and a statement of the threshold criteria-that may be agreed.
If there are any agreed documents –then you write and point out to CS that you agree the document.
If children’s services wanted to give a copy of any document (report or statement) filed in the court proceedings-then they will have to get the courts consent. If you did not want this to happen then you could oppose any application.

Other documents on the children’s file
You can request a copy of the children’s file by emailing or writing to CS and stating that you are requesting a full copy under the Data protection Act. There is a timescale that CS will follow and you may not get everything-see advice sheet 26 on access to records.
access to records

You have a right to ask that any factual inaccuracies are corrected. If it is a difference of opinion-then put your comments next to or in a letter on the file. If they refuse you could challenge the decision by making a complaint. There are different ways to do this including via your MP instead of the complaints department. See above to access advice sheet 25 about complaints.


Support from children’s servicesIs there any support for you and your family in the CP plan that you want to continue? You could ask that this continue and request that a child in need plan be drawn up. This would mean the continuing involvement of children’s services-which you may not want but it should mean a written plan which you could ask to be reviewed in 3 months time. This should set out a list of support that could be offered and who will provide the support.
For example, if you still want help from CAMHs then the social worker could be asked to make a referral on your behalf.
Please see our advice sheet 4on family support.
family support

Please post back. The information about your experiences are invaluable. It helps others who are going through the same process as you..
Best wishes,


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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by ange301126 » Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:40 am

It is interesting to rwead all suzie's comments and information of what correct procedure should be!However, in my case,and I suspect in many others correct procedure is not followed. Usually families trust social workers and solicitors to follow guidelines.I would be willing to bet that the problems most people have with the system are caused when they do not do so .All interested parties should check events and let us know what procedures were and were not followed in their cases.
Any families going through the system at this present time should keep in close touch with suzie to find out what should be happening because the social workers,guardians and solicitors will not do so.They can then go to their solicitor and insist things are done correctly.

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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by 4plus2 » Fri Feb 01, 2013 4:20 am

would love to chat on here as have no other outlet apart from my hubby who is just as stressed as i am by the mistakes made by social workers and often they have made things up as though they were writing a novel, one reported that there was faeces smeared across the top of my sons drawer unit which had not been cleaned up, in fact when another sw came to
look he agreed with us that it was brown paint which my son had splashed all around his room and had been missed by me cleaning as his drawer unit is very tall and im not! but that report is still in our records and keeps being brought up time and time again when, having proved beyond any doubt that it was paint, it surely should be deleted? am hoping i can help support others as well as recieve some suppoprt myself

thanks for reading xx

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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by blueplain » Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:53 am

I have the same 4plus2

unfortunately they are not allowed to remove any previous opinions from the completed assessment. What they do instead though is add the new information later to new reports to state that it was in fact paint. They always read the initial/core assessment as it was finalized before moving onto future or recent events. They do not inform us properly that the initial and core assessments are set in stone and they always begin discussing the findings of initial and core assessments

It was very upsetting for me because we kept reading and they kept discussing that our sons head was flat because of us not ever picking him up. It was discussed again and again even though it was found that the skull had fused early on his lamboid suture which is identified by flatness of the skull. Yet still this information has still not been added to the later part of the case reports which we are addressing through the complaints procedure.

I think the assessments are more to demonstrate why they are concerned and why they are proceeding or not rather then giving the full true picture of the case. Took me a while to understand that

So remember at each meeting they are going to discuss the findings of the assessments no matter how incorrect they turned out to be because it is a marker to reflect the future changes
I think it is a terrible system because it is very distressful to keep hearing and reading and I think it should be changed

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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by ange301126 » Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:12 am

a bit more chat for you, you'll all be disgusted with this one.

A woman in the late eighties had three children under four removed for adoption on the grounds of 'clear evidence of sex abuse'. This 'clear evidence ' emerged from the opinion of a 'lone' psychologist that two of the children (under 4) described sexual abuse after being questioned and encouraged to talk whilst being encouraged with anatomical dolls.

There was no physical evidence of any sex abuse and neither parent was charged with any offence. The parents had no knowledge of any sex abuse but on the psychologist's evidence ,they had to accept that some form of sex abuse had 'probably' occurred stating that it must have happened whilst the children were in care. This explanation was dismissed by the judge no doubt because the social workers were probably less likely to have abused the children than the parents were.
In 1989, the type of evidence used by the 'sole' psychologist was outlawed and the use of anatomical dolls discouraged along with the practice of encouraging children to 'talk freely' on the subject. A new Children's Act (1989) was instituted and procedures altered drastically.
During the nineties , it was found that several social workers in the particular area responsible for the children's care during the particular time of the events were guilty of the systematic sex abuse of children ' often within hours of them entering care'. They used the care system for their own wicked ends and a 'culture of sex abuse ' and the 'misuse of power' was said to have existed within the department during the eighties and early nineties. A number of social workers ( including the deputy head) were imprisoned after conviction at Crown Court.

Did the CS review matters and alter its files? No.

The mother remarried in 1998 and she had two more children. In 2006 ,both of them were taken away from her .The Social Workers cited the previous background information as their main concern and refused to look ar new background etc. etc. including new circumstances. Mother's past background was said to be 'the main concern'.

Thus mother has now lost five children !

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Re: why isn't there much chat on here yet?

Post by ange301126 » Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:29 pm

dear FRA members, what I cannot understand about this thread (WHY ISN'T THERE MUCH CHAT ON HERE YET?) is that it was started by Sandy in 2011 who wanted to chat but she hasn't been on since!! In 2011 TKH contributed as did Suzie and myself .Then nothing until 2013 when 4+2 said she would love to get a chat going and Blue Plain entered into it. I sent a message and now NOTHING AGAIN since February!
What annoys me is silence because this is what I get from social workers and solicitors. One would have thought that all the social workers, family rights workers and lawyers who read these forums would have been queuing up to comment on the problems which 4+2 ,Blueplain and I have written about and that they might be able to suggest ways we can correct the problems we have to face but the thread has just come to a full stop. Why ? Is it me?

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