Hi I am really looking for advice and hope any one can help.
Back in may me and my partner lived with my 6 children and I was currently pregnant.
My 8 yr old went to school and accused him of strangling her. The police phoned us and asked us to pop in the station. I did a statement and so did he. They also took a statement of one of my children as he was there to. MI be my partners and sons was the same but hers had extra bits in saying he strangled her.
He got nfa from the police but socials got involved and said he couldn't return home and be aline with my children.
They also brought concerns then for my 2 oldest as they have spent years making aligations against us. Most I have now proven were untrue.
One of them is very violent and me and my children get abuse of her on a daily basis. I have been hit by her.
I now have some children copying of her and trying to stop this happening. I can't stop the older one as I just get threatened by social services.
I have to report all events of abuse she dose to my children.
Four of my children cried most days wanting my partner back home but the two oldest said they don't. So due to this they said they have to do risk assessments and parenting assessments.
Due to this we had no choice but to not be together. Socials did ask why and we did say we didn't want to call it a day but due to all the aligations and because of socials we felt we had no choice.
They ended up putting them on child protection. First it was over the aligation against my x partner. Now it has turned mainly because of the oldest behaviour the impact it has on my other children. They also put them on plo. I have to work with certain agencies which I do. So do the children but the oldest ones refuse.
Even my daughter who made the aligation keeps asking for him home.
I now have had the baby and he has supervised visits. I don't really get any support. Socials said they are concerned about my other children the impact of the older ones. They are refusing to work with socials so can't see things changing they are getting worse. I have requested respite but been refused.
They asked if we will ever get back together I said we won't be aloud cos of my oldest and socials. They asked if k would like to. They said they could look into it as it goes on the assessments .
I really don't know what to do things are getting so worse. I do believe I am not been listened to. I feel for my younger children cos of the abuse from my oldest. Plus with them not been able to see my x partner as they asking for him on a daily basis
I really hope so one could give me some advice please
Child protection and plo
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4238
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:57 pm
Re: Child protection and plo
Dear M***
Welcome to the Parents forum.
I am sorry to hear about your families difficulties. It sounds like things are very stressful at the moment and you feel that no one is listening to you or offering support.
Not only that, you have lost the practical support of your exe partner as he has had to move out due to allegations of strangulation that your daughter against him. You are also having difficulties as one of your older children is being violent to you and the younger children.
These are the two main reasons why there is a child protection plan and why the public law outline (pre proceedings process) has started as well.
Your two older children
What stand out from your post are your worries about your younger children being hit by an older child. Has your older child got any health diagnoses that might affect her behaviour such as ADHD? Or a mental health problem such as anxiety?
Children services should be offering you support such as a family support worker or parenting classes to help you deal with your older child’s behaviour.
You mentioned that you were denied respite. Did children services give their reasons? Respite is still an option, if you feel things are becoming more difficult. (If children go into care, they should go to family or friends first before unrelated foster care. Is there anyone in your network who could look after any of your children if this should happen?)
The older children are also refusing to meet with the social worker. So their views are not being heard.
Could they have advocates to help them give their views to the social worker as well as get some support that they might need?
The National Youth Advocacy Service (NYAS) has an advice line for older children and young adults. It also offers advocates to children as well. Or is there someone at school, for example, who could talk to your older children?
Allegations against your ex- partner.
Your daughter made serious allegations against your ex- partner. Although the police are not prosecuting him, they have referred the matter to children services. Children services will carry out an assessment which will last up to 9 weeks. While that happens, to keep your children safe (in case he had been violent) children services asked him to move out of the family home. I would expect them to risk assess your ex- partner as he is the father of your baby. And certainly before he is allowed to return home.
Are you clear about what needs to happen before he can come back into the family home?
Public Law Outline (PLO) or pre- proceedings means that court (care) proceedings might be considered. PLO is the step before care proceedings. It is when children services and you with the help of a solicitor consider what support you need and also what you have to do as a mum to keep your children safe.
Care proceedings are very serious. If care proceedings do take place, children services would be asking for parental responsibility to make decisions about your children. So they could even decide where your children should live.
But before any court proceedings can take place, children services have to undertake assessments of you and your family and offer support to help you parent your children.
The most important thing is that you and dad are entitled to have separate solicitors to advise you and attend any public law outline (PLO) meeting. Do you have a solicitor? If not, you should find one who specialises in children law as soon as you can. Have a look at Law Society-find a solicitor .
A solicitor can argue your case with children services. They can help you ask for the support that you need and can advise you about what you need to do to improve your family’s situation. They can come to meetings with you to try and avoid things going to court.
Have you been offered a Family Group Conference?
This is a meeting where members of your support network (family and friends) come together to decide what help can be given to you and your family. It is a way that the family can sort things out themselves and come up with their own plan.
I hope this post helps. I have covered a lot of information so I hope it isn’t confusing. Please post back if you have any questions or call our advice line on 0808m 801 0366.
Best wishes,
Suzie
Welcome to the Parents forum.
I am sorry to hear about your families difficulties. It sounds like things are very stressful at the moment and you feel that no one is listening to you or offering support.
Not only that, you have lost the practical support of your exe partner as he has had to move out due to allegations of strangulation that your daughter against him. You are also having difficulties as one of your older children is being violent to you and the younger children.
These are the two main reasons why there is a child protection plan and why the public law outline (pre proceedings process) has started as well.
Your two older children
What stand out from your post are your worries about your younger children being hit by an older child. Has your older child got any health diagnoses that might affect her behaviour such as ADHD? Or a mental health problem such as anxiety?
Children services should be offering you support such as a family support worker or parenting classes to help you deal with your older child’s behaviour.
You mentioned that you were denied respite. Did children services give their reasons? Respite is still an option, if you feel things are becoming more difficult. (If children go into care, they should go to family or friends first before unrelated foster care. Is there anyone in your network who could look after any of your children if this should happen?)
The older children are also refusing to meet with the social worker. So their views are not being heard.
Could they have advocates to help them give their views to the social worker as well as get some support that they might need?
The National Youth Advocacy Service (NYAS) has an advice line for older children and young adults. It also offers advocates to children as well. Or is there someone at school, for example, who could talk to your older children?
Allegations against your ex- partner.
Your daughter made serious allegations against your ex- partner. Although the police are not prosecuting him, they have referred the matter to children services. Children services will carry out an assessment which will last up to 9 weeks. While that happens, to keep your children safe (in case he had been violent) children services asked him to move out of the family home. I would expect them to risk assess your ex- partner as he is the father of your baby. And certainly before he is allowed to return home.
Are you clear about what needs to happen before he can come back into the family home?
Public Law Outline (PLO) or pre- proceedings means that court (care) proceedings might be considered. PLO is the step before care proceedings. It is when children services and you with the help of a solicitor consider what support you need and also what you have to do as a mum to keep your children safe.
Care proceedings are very serious. If care proceedings do take place, children services would be asking for parental responsibility to make decisions about your children. So they could even decide where your children should live.
But before any court proceedings can take place, children services have to undertake assessments of you and your family and offer support to help you parent your children.
The most important thing is that you and dad are entitled to have separate solicitors to advise you and attend any public law outline (PLO) meeting. Do you have a solicitor? If not, you should find one who specialises in children law as soon as you can. Have a look at Law Society-find a solicitor .
A solicitor can argue your case with children services. They can help you ask for the support that you need and can advise you about what you need to do to improve your family’s situation. They can come to meetings with you to try and avoid things going to court.
Have you been offered a Family Group Conference?
This is a meeting where members of your support network (family and friends) come together to decide what help can be given to you and your family. It is a way that the family can sort things out themselves and come up with their own plan.
I hope this post helps. I have covered a lot of information so I hope it isn’t confusing. Please post back if you have any questions or call our advice line on 0808m 801 0366.
Best wishes,
Suzie
Re: Child protection and plo
Hi the older 2 have been refered to cams and refused to go. They have also been offered nyas but refused that to.
I see community support but she is unsure what else to recommend as she said she has witnessed me putting boundaries etc in place. She said no matter what I say they don't listen.
Last night there dad did take them as he said they were going to live with him and both girls are still saying they are living there. But all day I have had none stop messages and now saying he will only keep them a couple of days.
Should he not have to home them as it is down they want to be there and do listen to him
One of them has also just been kicked out of school for threatening to hit a child screaming in a teachers face and pushing him.
I do not feel it be safe for my children her returning as she is getting worse I don't know what to do.
I see community support but she is unsure what else to recommend as she said she has witnessed me putting boundaries etc in place. She said no matter what I say they don't listen.
Last night there dad did take them as he said they were going to live with him and both girls are still saying they are living there. But all day I have had none stop messages and now saying he will only keep them a couple of days.
Should he not have to home them as it is down they want to be there and do listen to him
One of them has also just been kicked out of school for threatening to hit a child screaming in a teachers face and pushing him.
I do not feel it be safe for my children her returning as she is getting worse I don't know what to do.
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Suzie, FRG Adviser
- Posts: 4238
- Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2011 2:57 pm
Re: Child protection and plo
Dear M***
It seems that your older children are not going to cooperate with the services being offered to them. This makes the situation harder for you to manage especially if you do not have good support.
If you believe your other children would be unsafe with them in the home then you may have to consider asking children services to accommodate them on the basis that they are beyond your control at the moment.
This would mean you agreeing to them being voluntarily placed in foster care. You would still have parental responsibility for them. Children services would not have parental responsibility and would only have this if the court made an interim care order in their favour at the beginning of care proceedings. It may be that the concerns about the impact on the younger children mean that children services are likely to make an application to the court for care orders with a care plan for the children to be in foster care. A copy of our advice sheet about the duties children services have when a child is in the care system is here for your information.
Children services really do have to consider very carefully the needs of all the children and provide appropriate support.
Unfortunately, no one can force the father to have the children but if he is able to manage them, then he should be thinking about what is best for his children. If the children live with him he would be entitled to receive any state benefits.
You can refuse to have your daughter home on the basis that it is not safe for the other children. This might cause her to resent you more but if she will not work with you or listen to you and her behaviour results in physical harm to you and the other children, you may not have a choice.
I do not know how old your children are but you may find the Challenging Behaviour Foundation may be able to provide you with helpful advice.
You should also ensure that you work the plan currently in place as agreed at your PLO meeting. I have included a copy of our advice sheet relating to care proceedings.
Please also consider the advise already given in the previous response to your first post.
Should you wish to speak to an adviser, please telephone our free, confidential advice line on 0808 801 0366. The advice line is open from 9.30 a.m. to 3.00 p.m. Monday to Friday.
I hope this helps.
Best wishes
Suzie
It seems that your older children are not going to cooperate with the services being offered to them. This makes the situation harder for you to manage especially if you do not have good support.
If you believe your other children would be unsafe with them in the home then you may have to consider asking children services to accommodate them on the basis that they are beyond your control at the moment.
This would mean you agreeing to them being voluntarily placed in foster care. You would still have parental responsibility for them. Children services would not have parental responsibility and would only have this if the court made an interim care order in their favour at the beginning of care proceedings. It may be that the concerns about the impact on the younger children mean that children services are likely to make an application to the court for care orders with a care plan for the children to be in foster care. A copy of our advice sheet about the duties children services have when a child is in the care system is here for your information.
Children services really do have to consider very carefully the needs of all the children and provide appropriate support.
Unfortunately, no one can force the father to have the children but if he is able to manage them, then he should be thinking about what is best for his children. If the children live with him he would be entitled to receive any state benefits.
You can refuse to have your daughter home on the basis that it is not safe for the other children. This might cause her to resent you more but if she will not work with you or listen to you and her behaviour results in physical harm to you and the other children, you may not have a choice.
I do not know how old your children are but you may find the Challenging Behaviour Foundation may be able to provide you with helpful advice.
You should also ensure that you work the plan currently in place as agreed at your PLO meeting. I have included a copy of our advice sheet relating to care proceedings.
Please also consider the advise already given in the previous response to your first post.
Should you wish to speak to an adviser, please telephone our free, confidential advice line on 0808 801 0366. The advice line is open from 9.30 a.m. to 3.00 p.m. Monday to Friday.
I hope this helps.
Best wishes
Suzie
Re: Child protection and plo
Hi thanks a lot for your reply
There dad has now stated they can live with him as he said he will start claiming but dose keep saying different things. I have stopped tgere claims so he can claim.
The only thing is he just sends them back even when I state I am unable to have them cos of the situation and the impact of the other children. Is there any thing I can do about him just sending them here with out me agrea in.
I have kept social services well updated on all this.
I have said loads to social services about there behaviour and the impact it is having on the other children and is a concern to them to. I did ask about foster but was refused.
When socials come out while they were at there dad's socials did say how different it is here and how much calmer.
Just unsure what I can do.
Thanks a lot
There dad has now stated they can live with him as he said he will start claiming but dose keep saying different things. I have stopped tgere claims so he can claim.
The only thing is he just sends them back even when I state I am unable to have them cos of the situation and the impact of the other children. Is there any thing I can do about him just sending them here with out me agrea in.
I have kept social services well updated on all this.
I have said loads to social services about there behaviour and the impact it is having on the other children and is a concern to them to. I did ask about foster but was refused.
When socials come out while they were at there dad's socials did say how different it is here and how much calmer.
Just unsure what I can do.
Thanks a lot
Re: Child protection and plo
HI forgot to say I am doing every thing that has been said in plo and did say my concerns regarding the older girls and the impact on the other children.
They did discuss looking into the girls living with there dad as he never went to the meeting but the girls had been stating they wanted to live there. Then after the meeting he just come and took them as girls said tgey were living with him
Thanks a lot
They did discuss looking into the girls living with there dad as he never went to the meeting but the girls had been stating they wanted to live there. Then after the meeting he just come and took them as girls said tgey were living with him
Thanks a lot
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