Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

I luv my children
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Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby I luv my children » Sun Jun 28, 2015 9:44 pm

I am returning to this forum after some time.
This is my first letter to the forum and look forward to receive some positive solution to our forthcoming problem. First I would like to paste a copy of my new, varied SOPO
04 April 2014: Extract from my new varied Order
Terms of variation: (my name) must not have any contact with any female child under the age of 16 years other than: such as inadvertent and not reasonably avoided in the course of lawful daily life or where the child is accompanied at all times by a person aged 18 years or more which has not been convicted of a sexual offence, an offence of decency or any offence against a child and with the consent of the child’s parent or guardian who has full knowledge of his sexual convictions and the existence of the order.
The order is to last until the 4.4.19
Also I would like to point out that my 15 year period on the Sex Offender register finishes in April 2016.
I have been remarried with my wife for the last 4 years and I had told her all about my order and conviction before we got married. Since than we have been happily married. Recently she got pregnant and the birth is due in October. Her scan showed that she is going to have a baby boy. On our last visit to the antenatal clinic we were told that the hospital was going to inform the social services about the forthcoming baby.
The SOPO does not apply to the boys. My wife is going to have maternity leave for a year. Then she is going to leave her job. I work nights, 12 hour long shifts, 4 to 5 days a week. While I will in the house she is going to with the baby all the time. Will have a bath or shower, or use the kitchen, when I am at work. If she needs to go to the toilet, either she will take the baby with her or I will leave the house. My conviction was again two 14 and 15 years old sisters. I have 5 girls and a boy, now all grown up, from my previous marriage. I have no record of any kind of abuse against my children.
We are getting worried that when the child is born, the Social services will take him away. My wife would not like to leave either me or my wife. I am a British citizen by naturalisation: I immigrated to the UK from Pakistan. But my wife is not a British citizen.
I read some time ago on a Social Services website, that they reckon that even the hard core child sex offenders do not abuse their own children. I can’t find that site. If anyone knows about it, could they please send me the link.
My offence was of indecent assault, 17 years ago, for which I was given 30 months sentence and after serving one—third I was released on licence. I had one breach of my order, 2007, but no child was involved. It was for attending my local gym. Without going into details, it was totally unintentional, and for this I was given 24 months, community rehabilitation and attended completely satisfactorily a Sex Offender Order In that period I had never even spoke to a child.
We both are going through a spell of serious depression and having sleepless nights.
We believe that Social Services cannot be above the Law
We both want to live together with our forthcoming baby. I would really appreciate advice from the Forum Members.
Judge Gareth Jones said that social services were not above the law and said he suspected that proper procedures were not followed by *******Council in order to save money.

Mr A***** argued that there was no legal basis which breached their client’s human rights to a family life.

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Suzie, FRG Adviser
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Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby Suzie, FRG Adviser » Mon Jun 29, 2015 11:16 am

Dear I luv my children

Welcome to Family Rights Group Parents’ Discussion Forum.

My name is Suzie and I am an Adviser at Family Rights Group.

I am sorry that you and your wife are having such a worrying time about your expected baby and what is likely to happen. In your post you say that your wife was told by the antenatal clinic that a referral would be made to Children Services (the new name for social services) about the baby. The hospital has a safeguarding role for children and the referral would be because of your status as a registered sex offender.
Whilst I understand what you say regarding the history of your offending and the Order placed on you, it likely that Children Services will want to carry out their own risk assessment. It is not clear from your post if the referral has already been made and Children Services has made contact with you and your wife. I am including here a copy of our advice sheet about child protection procedures which will give you details of the procedures Children Services are likely to follow once they receive a referral.

Children Services should contact you a day after receiving the referral and let you know what action they intend to take.
It is right the Children Services are not above the law but they do have legal duties where the safety and well being of children are concerned. They are required to follow correct procedures and carry out any assessment of parents or others in an open and transparent way.
If either you or your wife has had no previous involvement with Children Services you will find more information here about their role.

If Children Services do become involved with you and your wife I would advise you to cooperate fully with them. It would normally be the case that later into the pregnancy they will decide to have a meeting (pre-birth planning) to discuss what will happen when the baby is born. Children Services are not able to remove your child from your care without the parents’ or anyone else with parental responsibility agreement or with a court order. The only situation where a child can be removed without agreement or a court order is if the child is believed to be at risk of immediate harm, then the police can remove for 72 hours. After this, Children Services would need your permission or a court if they decide the child should not be returned to your care.

You and your wife might want to think about other family or friends who might be able to care for your baby if Children Services decided to take action to remove him from your care. Please look at our film about Family Group Conference and our advice sheet

I hope you will find the information helpful. Should you wish to speak to an Adviser, please telephone our advice line on 0808 801 0366, the line is open from 9.30 a.m. to 3.00 p.m. Monday to Friday.

Best wishes

Suzie

I luv my children
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Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:30 pm

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby I luv my children » Tue Jul 14, 2015 11:13 am

Thank Suzie, you for your valuable advice. I would like to remind you that my wife is pregnant, expecting a baby boy in October 2015. A social worker came yesterday. My wife has recently come to this country, so we had asked her to bring an interpreter. But she came without an interpreter, saying she could not find one. My wife let her in for not being taken as uncooperative. I hope my wife got the gist what the social worker told her but surely she could not explain as much she would have liked to. The Social Worker did not involve me in the meeting. I hope my wife understood her rightly, when the Social Worker advised her to keep me away until next April 2015, when the period of 15 years of me being on sex offender register expires. At the same time I am on SOPO , a copy of which I am giving below for your ready reference:.
04 April 2014: Extract from my new varied Order
Terms of variation: (my name) must not have any contact with any female child under the age of 16 years other than: such as inadvertent and not reasonably avoided in the course of lawful daily life or where the child is accompanied at all times by a person aged 18 years or more which has not been convicted of a sexual offence, an offence of decency or any offence against a child and with the consent of the child’s parent or guardian who has full knowledge of his sexual convictions and the existence of the order.
The order is to last until the 4.4.19
Also I would like to point out that my 15 year period on the Sex Offender register finishes in April 2016.
I have found the following Comments from senior judges
Judge *****said that social services were not above the law and said he suspected that proper procedures were not followed by ****** Council in order to save money.

Mr A******* argued that there was no legal basis which breached their client’s human rights to a family life
In a nutshell my arguments are:
The children services did not follow the proper procedure. Despite our repeated request, she came without an interpreter, and that she did not involve me father. And
1. 1. The SOPO, as quoted above, does not prohibit any interaction with boys.
2. I have no offences against your own children.
2. the judge reinforces the point that if there is no threat, there should be no restrictions.
3. Contact with girls u/16 as long , as the girls’ parent are aware of my conviction, as I am not alone with them and it is supervised by an adult with no previous sex related conviction
So could you kindly advise me what the next line of action we should take. We do not want the family to split.
I tried to phone you, but the lines were very busy.

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Suzie, FRG Adviser
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Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby Suzie, FRG Adviser » Wed Jul 15, 2015 3:33 pm

Dear I luv my children

Thank you for your post. I see that you were sent a number of our advice sheets already regarding child protection procedures and Children Services role. Please do read these as you will find a lot of information in the advice sheets.

It is concerning that the social worker met with your wife without an interpreter especially if her English is poor and she may not fully understand the information she is being given. I suggest that it is put in writing to Children Services that an interpreter is required as it is not good enough just to say could not find one.

The social worker should include you in discussions about plans for your child and I suggest you read here on our website in respect of fathers being involved.

As to the procedures as your wife pregnancy progresses it is likely that Children Services will hold a pre birth planning meeting to decide what will happen when the baby is born and what their expectations are. If needed, you and your wife can have someone attend with you, for example, a family member, friend, professional or community leader meetings.

Please also look at the interactive section of our website here for parents.


I hope this clarifies the situation for you. Please do continue to try to get through on the advice line although it does get very busy.

Best wishes,

Suzie

I luv my children
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Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:30 pm

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby I luv my children » Thu Jul 23, 2015 7:22 pm

Thanks Suzie for your reply to my two posts. However I would like know that can the Children Services can stop me have any contact to the male child to be borne. My SOPO does not put any prohibitions on having any contacts with boys. My only conviction was 17 years ago against two teen aged sisters. Since than I have not even spoken to a child. From my previous posts you will notice that even the senior judges endorse that unless my previous conviction were against my own family, such restrictions cannot be imposed. A social worker is coming to see us next week. I don’t know how can I convince her that I am safe with children:

I luv my children
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:30 pm

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby I luv my children » Thu Jul 23, 2015 7:24 pm

Thanks for your reply to my two posts. However I would like know that can the Children Services can stop me have any contact to the male child to be borne. My SOPO does not put any prohibitions on having any contacts with boys. My only conviction was 17 years ago against two teen aged sisters. Since than I have not even spoken to a child. From my previous posts you will notice that even the senior judges endorse that unless my previous conviction were against my own family, such restrictions cannot be imposed. A social worker is coming to see us next week. I don’t know how can I convince her that I am safe with children:

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Suzie, FRG Adviser
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Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby Suzie, FRG Adviser » Mon Jul 27, 2015 1:54 pm

Dear I luv my children,

Thank you for posting again. I can see that you are worried about the social workers involvement with your family.

Because of your past conviction, the social worker will want to carry out an assessment to find out whether you could pose a risk to your son.
The social worker will assess your son’s needs, assess Mums and your parenting ability, assess the environment that you live in and the family and friends and community support that you have.
At the end of the assessment they will either close the case, decide that your son is a child in need (and if he needs support set out how this will happen).
If during the assessment, the social worker thought your son might be at risk of being harmed, then the assessment would become a child protection investigation.

The assessment opens up-to look at everything-so she may look at your relationship with mum, for example, and whether either you have any health needs that might impact upon your parenting.

Children services may also ask that you are assessed by a specialist. To find out more about this assessment you could contact the Lucy Faithfull Foundation who advise about sexual abuse in families.

The assessment will involve meetings with you and mum. The social worker will also want your consent to contact any professionals who can share information about your family-such as the GP, midwife, police and probation.
Certainly show her a copy of the judgment from the court and any assessments that have been done in the past.
The best way forward is to cooperate with the assessment process. If you didn’t, then the social worker would not know your risk so may have to assume that you are high risk when you may not be.


If the matter goes into a child protection conference, have a look at our film of a child protection conference and our FAQ’s about child protection.

You can also ring our advice line on 0808 801 0366.

Best wishes,

Suzie

I luv my children
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Jun 18, 2015 10:30 pm

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby I luv my children » Fri Aug 14, 2015 11:55 am

Hello: You will notice from my previous posts that I am on SOPO which has prohibitions that I can have contacts with females under 16 only under supervision. It has no restrictions on contact with boys u/16.

I got remarried about 6 years ago and now my wife is pregnant and expecting a baby boy in November 2015. Now there has been a midwife and two social workers to our house. Apart from the first Social Worker, who met my wife only but not me, the other two women seemed to be sympathetic. They are referring me to a psychologist for assessment.

Now I am weary that she/he might put words in my mouth. I wonder what she/he will be asking? Will she/he be assessing that whether or not I am: a) safe with girls, b) safe with boys c) safe with my own children? Why the Social Worker do not accept that the Law allows me to have contact with boys; the social workers can’t be above the law. I wonder if it will be helpful if I could go to court and get my SOPO varied lifting any restriction on my children to be born.

A quick reply will be highly appreciated. I have read senior judges remarks that restriction son contact with the offender’s own children might only needed if he had previously abused his own children. “Smith: If there is no suggestion of risk to defendants own family it is unnecessary to impose restrictions which extend to them. If such a risk exits any order ought to be subject to any order made in family proceedings”

justiceisaright
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Joined: Thu Feb 20, 2014 1:20 am

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby justiceisaright » Sat Aug 15, 2015 1:18 am

This is the luck of the draw really. It depends on the social work team who is working on your case especially management, their personal bias, and the psyche assessor who will specialize in sexual risk assessments. You may find that they are open minded once looking at the circumstances in your previous history. Or they could take a very heavy handed approach.

Murray72
Posts: 116
Joined: Mon Mar 12, 2012 10:48 am

Re: Social Services Might Take away our forth coming child

Postby Murray72 » Sun Aug 16, 2015 5:35 pm

Hi,
Do you know if the psychologist is a specialist in sexual behaviour, if they are then you should find the assessment fair however a generalised one may be a little biased. It might be worth contacting your local sexual behaviour unit or even speak to your offender manager (if your still on the SOPO) and ask them if they can recommend anyone. You need someone who has a proven track record in that field.

During care proceedings myself and the offender (ex husband) had to undergo this assessment and I found them helpful in supporting my case, and the risks they highlighted in the offender were spookily accurate (yes he did continue to offend).

good Luck with future baby.


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