child not returned after access visit

[nett]

well spoken to solicitor ,and he thinks that we should go for residence , but has made appointment for 6th july will let you know how it goes from there keep your fingers crossed for us x not had any contact with mother for over a week now ,she ignoring us so dnt know what is going on , just want things to start taking form now , at least we are getting a lil of somewhere now x

[Bonnie]

mum maybe fighting it, she will have been told to keep away from you.

If you are fighting for the children, you will have to distance your self from mum, you have to be seen to be putting the children first, the ss may say they do not trust you with the children around mum.
Just keep doing what your doing [:D]

(((H U G S )))

[nett]

ok will do thank you , was talking to older girl on f/b last night she was begging me to go get her and said her mum was gunna slap her ,she ddnt get a chance to say what 4 ,then mum came on and said all ok she was messing around with her friend ,she ddnt sound like she was messing to me , what do u do ,tried to tlk 2 mum and she ignoring me today ,my hubby said leave it it cld b the child has not got her own way , but still not convinced ,dnt want to inform s/s/ as this will make matters worse

[Bonnie]

Hi Nett,
When ever you have a conversation, write it down, if on facebook copy and keep profile photo with the conversation, just incase, you never know, mum could twist things.just keep times and dates of events too, then you have back up, the same for text messages too!

(((H U G S )))

[nett]

thank you will do ,never thought of that ,shame bout last night i have not saved it either , will remember to do it in future ,think mum has stopped her going on now she not been on tonight , thanx for the info xx

[nett]

yes that is good advice , we will not contact the family now as we dnt want to put a spanner in the works , mum refuses to give the kids our phone number so we dnt get to speak to them but they in court in 6 weeks so it not long , i know it is awful to say but i hope she does lose them now as she does deserve it , she is been horrible to them wnt even let them go out or do anything she just grounds them all the time for no reason ,the kids are clearly not happy there ,but she sees she doing nothing wrong , and the house is a mess it is getting worse ,she isnt doing anything , but like i say not long now

[nett]

hi all been to see solicitor and bad news , he said that we would probably not get the children ,due to their state of minds when they b removed as thay will b too traumatised , he said that in his eyes that we would b turned down , due to the size of our family now ,we have 3 boys ourselves ages 15 nearly 16 and 10 and 9 and how it would affect them , having to ive the children attention when they come ,he said that he will apply for funding and apply to courts for independant assessment but he said he dnt think it will make a difference we have to give answer by friday as to what to do, well WHAT DO WE DO ,we have got nothing to lose now

[David Roth]

Nett, what do you think of this yourself?

The suggestion seems to be that the children would be so traumatised that it would be too difficult for you to manage them and your own children, with possible negative effects on your own three boys.

Firstly, do you accept that the children are so severely traumatised as the solicitor implies? You report him saying how traumatised they would be, not how traumatised they are. Do you agree that they are traumatised, or that they will be as traumatised as the solicitor thinks? It may be less traumatic for them to come to you, as a family member they know, than to go and live with strangers.

If the children really are troubled, do you think you would be able to manage their trauma, and the way they behaved? What effect do you think it would have on your own children? You obviously have a duty to your own family as well as to these children.

If you want to continue with your application for the children, you will need to show that you have given serious consideration to these questions. If you have any previous experience of dealing with traumatised children, or you are able to show that your children would be able to be tolerant and understanding when the children acted out, then that would certainly help your case.

Do you know what the children are saying they want? If they are saying they want to come to you, they may be more motivated to make it work with you than if they have to go somewhere they don't want to.

This does sound like a very difficult situation, and I hope you re able to reach a solution that will be right for everyone. Even if the children don't come to you, you should try to ensure that you can still play a role in their lives.

David R
FRG Policy Adviser

[Kate]

Nett, what a horrible situation for you. David's post is excellent and I hope it helps you to get all your thoughts in order so you can consider this realistically as well as going with what your heart tells you to do. It is vital to be aware of the massive disruption that taking on traumatised children can cause to a family, and the threat it can cause to the wellbeing of the children already in the family. I'm sure you know all this already, but sometimes we need to stop and consider it from all angles.

I am wondering what the evidence is for the children being so traumatised, and whether it's believed that the very young ones are going to present with trauma which is going to be very difficult to manage and get them through. I can see that if there are major concerns about the older children it could a major issue for your own children, but is it believed that the little ones would cause serious disruption to the family? I'm not saying babies and very young children can't be severely traumatised, causing them longterm damage, because they certainly can. But they are not as likely to be a threat to your own children's wellbeing, provided your children accept that these little ones would need a great deal of your time and care.

As regards the older children, I think you may have said in an earlier post on the forum that you have had the children for holidays? If so, you know them and you know what their issues are likely to be. OK, children can behave very differently on holidays and in the short term than they might when they are permanently within the family, but even so you should have some idea of the challenges they might present you all with.

Sending good thoughts to you as you grapple with all this between now and tomorrow. It is an agonising position to be in.

[nett]

hi all and thanx for your comments ,the older boy has said that he wishes to stay with mum as he will b 15 in september ,the girl is 13 and she has said to s/s and guardian that she wants to come to live with us , the children from my point of view are not as bad as s/s are saying and have never caused us any trouble , he is very bitter as he needs a man figure and he is close to my husband , and the girl is very close to me , as we are them , the younger ones are young enough to ajust and with love and attention i dont think that they will miss their mum very much , my children know the situation and are happy to have the children with us ,we have just moved yesterday also to a 5 bed 4 bathroom property so as the children have more space and privacy to allow them to escape to somewhere quiet if needs be , they are also saying that as my husband had a breakdown 10yrs ago and did turn to drink ,but has not drank for 8yrs or more that this may affect him ,the breakdown was due to him losing his sister very unexpectidly and suddenly ,she was the one who had residence of the older children ,when she died they were returned back to mother , we have phoned the solicitor today and asked him to go ahead with things , and independant assessment etc ,then at least we have done all we can , we have nothing to lose by doing this , we shall have to wait and see the outcome of this , then we will have to consider options further if not successful , and keep fighting the motto being where theres a will theres a way , sorry this is so long people hope you get a better picture and thank you all for your support xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx