Children's minister supports family & friends care

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Help 1870
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by Help 1870 » Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:09 am


It would be interesting to compare the breakdown rates for adoption against the breakdown rates for SGO. Obviously only since SGO's came into force.


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David Roth
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by David Roth » Tue Jul 19, 2011 10:36 am

In his report, Martin Narey queried whether the rate for adoption breakdowns is as high as current estimates place it. It is very hard to get reliable information about this, as it is not centrally recorded, so it would be interesting to see a review of the methodology that brought him to this conclusion.

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fatcat
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by fatcat » Tue Jul 19, 2011 4:49 pm

when undertaking a study like this one would need to differentiate between foster carer SGO and family SGO as the dynamics would be very different. i would like to believe that when considering the making of any order that due consideration is given to the best intersts of the child, who has to be the priority in all of this. my understanding is that adoption is considered by most LA's as the last resort, only when parents and family have been discounted.

for some children, adoption is the most appropriate order because there are circumstances when family won't always be the best choice, for whatever reason.

a family placement does come with its own set of problems, such as conflict with the parents, ongoing triggers for the child, complex contact arrangements. there are many posts on this forum about children still being exposed to trauma by their parents or other relatives, and the stress that this places on the placement.

the ideal for a child will always be to remain with parents who will love and care for them. in my opinion, anything else boils down to the least worst option.

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Robin D
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by Robin D » Tue Jul 19, 2011 5:22 pm

quote:Originally posted by fatcat

.. in my opinion, anything else boils down to the least worst option.
Well said Fatcat.

Grandparent carer in Suffolk [:)]
Former F&F carer, foster carer, adopter and respite carer for umpteen children. Now retired and when with kids, making sure they 'go home' at the end of the day.

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David Roth
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by David Roth » Wed Jul 20, 2011 9:59 am

It would be nice to think that adoption was the last resort for local authorities.

When I did a study of contact last year, I carried out individual interviews with eleven family and friends carers. Of these, five were raising more than one child who were siblings. Of those five, three had had to fight the local authority to keep the siblings together. In all three cases, the local authority had wanted to place the youngest child separately, two for adoption and one with a person they had already identified for a residence order. These carers had all succeeded in their struggle with the local authority, and the siblings were growing up quite happily together.

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fatcat
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by fatcat » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:00 pm

i think it is going to be a difficult call to make in some cases. i a child has been harmed by their parents they could then go to foster care, and the plan should be that their next move will be their very last. if there are doubts about the family carer the sw then has to decide how to proceed, and ask what would happen if the child is placed and it doesn't work out. the child might haveto come back into foster carer and then wait for an adoptive placement. by this time the child could be even older, and also in their 4th placement, with their 4th primary carer, and the likelihood of a permanent family could be lost to them.

its great when it can work out for the best, and i'm glad that my children benefitted from a sensible decision, but i should imagine that there are many cases when its a really difficult decision. i've met carers who have managed to keep the children in the family and drag them up just well enough to keep social services from the door, and i really don't think thats right.

youngagain
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by youngagain » Wed Jul 20, 2011 1:58 pm

It is my understanding that local authorities play a major role in the delays experienced by children in their placements. Our experiences demonstrate that as do many others on this forum so I think it fair to say that some social service departments are dysfunctional for what ever reason.That is not to say that some families are also but every case if different and that really goes I feel to the hub of the issue.
Every case is different and there are only one sat of laws and rules. Then chuck in some unprofessional social worker and you can see how a case can take for ever.
I feel that whilst the local authorities have a duty to administer the various laws in care proceedings, they are far too often happy to keep children in care without fully considering the damage that it does to them.The point is as we eventually gained PR over our grandchild after 11 months and passing an assessment, this proves that she could have been placed with us from the outset. Yes I think that some local authorities get it wrong and when they do the children suffer.
Oh and Tim Loughton, I expect that he would decline to look after any of his family if he should be unfortunate enough that one of his children (if he has any) should be unable to.

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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by youngagain » Wed Jul 20, 2011 2:02 pm

Whoops actually it was'nt Tim Loughton who made the comment sorry Tim[:I]

fatcat
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by fatcat » Wed Jul 20, 2011 3:59 pm

my children were lucky because the sw brought them to me as soon as they were removed, and everything had been planned in advance. we still had an assessment, and it was 8 months before the residence order was granted. that's because the parents were so bad there was no need for the court to grant additional assessments after theparents failed the first one.

if the parents had started to work with the social worker and start making improvements, then it is likely tha things would have gone on for a lot longer, and the children might even have gone back to them.

its the parents lawyers who can really delay things because they are the ones who ask for more chances and assessments.

its great that you were given the children eventually, and its sad that they were in foster care first, but social services usually need to check things out first and feel confident that the children will be safe. when we were in court the parents were really going for us because we already had the children, and they thought we were plotting to keep them. even now, 7 years later, they hate us andhave tried to turn the children against us. if the children were in foster care at the time i think the parents would have directed all of their venom towards the social worker rather than us, and maybe at the end would have just been grateful that the children were coming out of care in back to the family.


as i said earlier, just looking at the least worst optons.

youngagain
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Re: Children's minister supports family & friends care

Post by youngagain » Wed Jul 20, 2011 4:59 pm

I agree, ours was probably not unusual but as the mother (who incidentally has a quite serious mental health problem)initially apparently told the social worker that she did not want the child placed with us, the ss seized on this. I am sure they had a job to do but in our case, one left the L.A. along with the L.A. acting solicitor
at the end of the proceedings. I remember when we had our residency order granted, the bad social worker was so furious she told us that we could never work again, could not go on holiday and tried to force us in to signing an agreement.She then said to my wife "you like to get your own way dont you?well you wont this time, I am going to have her adopted" So it was very difficult to deal with this person a somewhat power crazed bully who left an indelible impression on our minds and kept little one from the family.

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